While I agree with you that a patient should have the right to go wherever they want for their "caregiver" services, I completely disagree with your analysis here, and I'll begin with this:

1) Your link is broken, but I went on Cannabis U's site and checked out the Patient Campaign. This looks to be an effort within the community (and a good one I think) to try and get the state to accept multiple caregiver nominations per patient. It's what they want the law to be, not necessarily what it is.

From A-20:
“A patient who has not designated a primary caregiver at the time of application may do so in writing at any time during the effective period of the registry identification card, and the primary caregiver may act in this capacity after such designation.”

2) Just because the language in Amendment 20 implicitly gives a patient the option of not nominating caregiver, that is by no means the same as saying that a) they can buy from any dispensary, and b) the dispensary can sell to any patient that comes strolling to their door. Reading the next section from A-20 I think helps explain why I think that's not a smart idea:

(2) (a) “ … a patient or primary care-giver charged with a violation of the state's criminal laws related to the patient's medical use of marijuana will be deemed to have established an affirmative defense to such allegation where:

(III) The patient and his or her primary care-giver were collectively in possession of amounts of marijuana only as permitted under this section.”

This language here doesn’t help the dispensaries that are taking the “de facto/ad hoc caregiver” argument. Primary doesn’t seem synonymous with ad hoc or de facto to me. It seems pretty clear that the spirit of the law is that either a) as a patient, you grow your own, or b) you assign those rights to a caregiver.

But if some non-patient walks into your door and you sell to them, well, you're selling one of your patient's product aren't you? That's the bottom line. You aren't suddenly growing on the spot for this stranger. You're dipping into your actual patient's products, to which they're legally entitled.

So to say that, because Amendment 20 doesn’t force you to choose a caregiver, you therefore can buy from anyone seems like total wishful thinking. It's a big jump, and one in which you may eventually take a big fall for. A safer interpretation would be to assume that the A-20 drafters meant that, if you don’t nominate a caregiver, you’re therefore growing for yourself. No mention of Walgreens is included in A-20, as much as we would like it.

Again, I support this and hope that patients and caregiver end up explicitly receiving this option. But it's not cool coming on here and labeling other dispensary owners liars about it. They're just being safer than you are - Mr. Dispensary Owner. Some could reasonably say that you have a not so altruistic interest in taking such a righteous stand.

Anyway, good luck, and remember - it's usually the fastest car on the highway that gets pulled over.

if a patient can get it anywhere like it says in the law pretty much and your growing for a patient that says they only want 2 oz's a month then that leaves alot of room to sell the rest to others in need?

it still is'nt clear to me how if your a grower you can only have such and such on hand by law per patient.but a shop seems to have so much more than that on hand at all times? if cops walked into a caregivers grow room and he was only allowed 3 in bloom and he had 4 he's going to jail yet shops seems to have much more than they do patients"just guessing about that" and they are good to go? i also have talked to a couple lawyers about this and they said sometimes u can be doing everything legal to the t and leo will and do just walk in and take your shit and or find a way to lock u up.

now i don't know if thats true or if they are just trying to get me to hire them but from what i get from all this is even tho it's legal it's not in the eyes of the leo and they will try to find another way to take u down?not sure has anyone had anything like that happen or leo come to there house and all was good?

my understanding was 2 oz dry and 6 plant count per caregiver/patient?yet i see things like i have a doc note that allows me to grow 20 plants myself.i was told that u may have a docs note but it's still not legal and u will go to jail if leo sees it.who knows im treating it as if it was still completely illegal.

__________________
(loose lips sink ships):
(the only easy day was yesterday)
(u need to be wise and learn the art of shutup)
(one time this girl told me i was hung like a baby.........9p 3oz what can i say)
(if u can't hang wit the big boys then don't show up)
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Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." ~ Anonymous

im the guy everyone loves to hate, but knows is right.

Dispensaries may be growing for themselves, or they may be assigning their grow rights (via contract) to actual growers, and then buying that product. It's in a dispensary's best interest to get as many people to nominate them as caregiver, then turn around and either grow or assign for grow. Many of these places have hundreds, if not thousands of patients who designate them, so yes, they can have lots of product on hand.

As far as cops just coming in and busting you, even if you're following the law, well, I haven't been hearing these stories. As a matter of fact, the Boulder County Sheriff isn't even actively looking into dispensaries because of their potential liability if they do a bust, then confiscate the product. Police under A-20 have a duty to preserve product until such time that the suspect has either been charged, or not. They don't want to end up spending their police budget on pot gone bad, or anything else they fuck up.

I'm sure there are some hard-ass cops out there who are itching to shut people down, and there's probably some horror stories out there, but that doesn't seem to be happening in CO now. I'd love to hear if it has. But I think you're right - those attorneys are probably trying to drum up some more biz by putting the fear of Jah in you. Much better to have the Light of Jah!

Any amounts over the 2-3-3 limit may be considered an affirmative defense if you have a doctor supporting it. So if a patient can't smoke, and needs to ingest for example, she'd be more likely to get away with exceeding the limits. But if you're some UC student with a prescription for severe pain, forget about it.

All in all I agree, a grower can easily exceed even a couple oz's per month for one patient, so why not be allowed to supply the dispensaries who need the product? It's being done a lot, and there are legal ways to help protect yourself as a grower. Hopefully, before too long, there will be some clarification to the law that allows growers some peace of mind.

Patients Choice of Colorado is a MEDICAL marijuana dispensary. We are truly helping those in need, and doing our best to provide medicine at the best price we can. As many have mentioned, the easiest way for us to provide the best quality, consistency, and price is if we grow our own meds. It takes time to get gardens on line and running properly. Even with what we are doing, demand is outstripping supply. We have and plan on offering $10 gram to our members for certain in house strains. Our goal is to get what we produce down to about $10 - $14 a gram.***WE NOW ARE OFFERING 10 DOLLAR MEDICINE GRAMS OF WHITE WIDOW AND ENDLESS SKY TO OUR MEMBERS.**so we truly are trying to go in that direction as much as possible.

But what I want to discuss is the medical side of this movement. In order for us to provide our own in house medicine, have medicine on the shelves, and have legal coverage for our staff, we need a certain amount of patients that sign us up as their primary caregiver. Some people have said that dispensaries are not caregivers. That could not be farther from the truth. We promote alternatives to traditional care. We have massage therapy, music therapy, acupuncture, and are looking into other forms of alternative healing. We also highly promote nutrition as a preventative to disease.

And on prices, for our outside growers, we pay upwards to $4,800 a pound for certain strains. The ones that don't sell, we don't buy back; the ones that do, we buy. We think its high, but there also needs to be education on how long certain strains take to grow, their yield, and expertise level. If you have a 42 day finisher, of course that is our cheapest medication. Next you have an 70 day finisher; should that be the same price? You will never find super high quality meds that take longer to grow unless you are willing to compensate that grower for his extra time and resources.

I also want to point out that the CDPHE via their rule-making meeting on July 20th also clarified that providing and growing do constitute as care-giving. We also strongly promote people using their six plant option to grow their own and reduce the amount they need from anyone. We have helped many people set up grow rooms for free. We believe in sustainability of all kinds, particularly economic, and growing your own, and growing it well, is extremely beneficial for patients and the community.

However, many of our patients either are physically unable to grow, do not have the time, or many do not want to grow or can't because of living situations. Every person's story is different, and that is what makes us so dynamic. But together, we will grow our scene into a caring, informational, and truly wonderful and safe environment for medical patients to not only get their medications, but interact with a community of like-minded individuals with a common, caring goal. Hopefully this movement will transcend into full legalization from the present tyranical and draconian actions used by the federal government.

One thing most people overlook in this movement, from what I understand from our lawyer, is that every thc product in any dispensary must be grown, made, baked in Colorado. No beasters, no cali bud/hash/baked goods, every product must be from Colorado, and every thc medicine in Patients Choice is grown, baked, made in Colorado. It will take us sometime to meet the demand, particularly without these outside sources, but we are improving everyday.
We wish all of you peace, love, understanding, and respect,
Thank you
Patients Choice of Colorado

My experiences at your dispensary do not remotely resemble your description.
After five months with you as my caregiver all I received were promises.
When I brought up my complaints I was told my membership would be canceled.
Compassionate? Hardly.
I would suggest finding another dispensary. Better yet grow your own medicine.
Patients Choice is for patient chumps!

Regards

We have over 15-20 strains available at anytime,we also have eatables, we never charge over $350.00 per zip. Grateful Meds, it's worth the drive to Nederland.

Grateful Meds
Nederland Colorado
303 258 7703
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I think it's absolutely dispicable that there are people trying to take advantage and mislead people who really need marijuana as a medicine.

That to me is really fucked up.

__________________

I Love You Robby!

"I love the smell of napalm in the morning. You know, one time we had a hill bombed, for 12 hours. When it was all over, I walked up. We didn't find one of 'em, not one stinkin' dink body. The smell, you know that gasoline smell, the whole hill. Smelled like, victory. Someday this war's gonna end.."

- Kilgore (Apocalypse Now)

Not nearly as fucked up as what mainstream insurance and pharmaceutical companies are up to right now. Charging $400 an ounce seems pretty tame compared to the horror stories I've been reading.

*shrug*

I agree.

Everything is a racket nowadays.

It's really a shame.

That sort of shit makes me feel some sort of way...

__________________

I Love You Robby!

"I love the smell of napalm in the morning. You know, one time we had a hill bombed, for 12 hours. When it was all over, I walked up. We didn't find one of 'em, not one stinkin' dink body. The smell, you know that gasoline smell, the whole hill. Smelled like, victory. Someday this war's gonna end.."

- Kilgore (Apocalypse Now)

Again, we do apologize for your experience. I recognize who you are. Yes when we first opened we thought we would have clones available way sooner than we did. Due to different garden issues it was Our mistake big time, My husband aplogized and told you he would call you when they were available. He did not call you in that next week because they were not available and you called again very angry. We do not drop people because they communicate their feelings. We welcome communication. But it is they way feelings that are communicated that matters. I think we tried our best with you, and like I said we made mistakes by giving deadlines on when we thought the clones would be done. it is not that we do/did not care. we really do care. Appreciate your feedback, showing us what we can do better.
wishing you all the best and hope you are well.
Peace
PCC

from what iv'e seen sum people just want everything handed to them then when u say well grow your own then if it's that easy and free.then that pisses them off.so if u say u can grow your own all day long and that pisses u off then that must mean u want it for free?

also these same people talk about compassion yet they want u to labor fit the bill for eveything and then give it away? it's the same as any farmer out there.should a corn farmer show "compassion" and give his crop away to cause u need to eat? what about him and his fam? should he take the food from his own family's mouth just so u can get a freebie?after all these same people say things like it only cost 400 to grow a whole crop.lmao just shows u they either never done it or trying to round up the ones that have'nt to make the shops and growers look like greedy pos's.what gets them every time tho is when u say ok u grow it and i'll be sitting here waiting on your crop so we can have it all for free.they get mad and go to name calling then.

they want it legal like everything else but then don't want it to be like everything else?everything thats legal meds and all has a price.see when u put forth truth like i do u can always see the ones that think like this come out and start name calling.

u don't see them calling the butcher a pos for what he charges. u never here them cry about the dealers on the street that rip them off when ever they feel like it cause they can and sell them a short oz or tell them "this shits the fire u need this..450 plz and it turns out to be bunk?not 1 peep but make it legal and open a shop well you no good pos u. you greedy sob this and that as if the street dealers arn't raping and making a killing.lmao weak and a lack of understanding of the world or they just want it all but only if your legal and grow pot should u give it away everything else no prob.

__________________
(loose lips sink ships):
(the only easy day was yesterday)
(u need to be wise and learn the art of shutup)
(one time this girl told me i was hung like a baby.........9p 3oz what can i say)
(if u can't hang wit the big boys then don't show up)
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." ~ Anonymous

im the guy everyone loves to hate, but knows is right.

"We do not drop people because they communicate their feelings. We welcome communication. But it is they way feelings that are communicated that matters. I think we tried our best with you, and like I said we made mistakes by giving deadlines on when we thought the clones would be done. it is not that we do/did not care. we really do care. Appreciate your feedback, showing us what we can do better.
wishing you all the best and hope you are well."

You tried your best with Me? What did you do?
Thank you for your best wishes.
Regards

I've never put the pencil to it, but the idea that it only costs $400.00 to grow a pound of pot is a stretch, IMO. Unless you're growing a very small amount, I'm wondering how you came to this conclusion unless you don't include the time it takes a grower to tend his crop. I consider my time to be worth $500.00 per day, minimum. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but just the dirt in one of my 32 gallon pots costs about $60.00. Add to this organic fertilizers, pesticides/fungicides, PH up/down treatments, utility costs for HID lighting, propane or natural gas heat of a greenhouse, electric costs and infrastructure costs for a professional greenhouse structure.......ie....fans, dehumidifiers, automated venting, C02 emitters, timers and most of all the time it takes a grower to meticulously inspect, care for, feed and finally cut manicure and properly cure each plant so that it yields extremely high medical grade product with no residues and I'd say that the combination of all of these expenses .....especially when you calculate into the equation a grower's time, might work out to a bit more than $400.00.

these guys that think like that 400$ guys they are setup in a closet with a couple of cfl's pulling about 2 or 3 oz's every 2 months.+ they think high times is a growers bible lmao.

__________________
(loose lips sink ships):
(the only easy day was yesterday)
(u need to be wise and learn the art of shutup)
(one time this girl told me i was hung like a baby.........9p 3oz what can i say)
(if u can't hang wit the big boys then don't show up)
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." ~ Anonymous

im the guy everyone loves to hate, but knows is right.

OK - I'm feeling like an idiot. I just made my first trip to a dispensary. I was filling out some paperwork before I could purchase and one section was talking about assigning them as primary caregiver. I told the guy I had already assigned a primary on my application. He told me that the person I assigned was my "state caregiver" and that assigning them as my "primary caregiver" just allowed them to sell to me. They also said I could assign multiple primary caregivers. They showed me this form http://www.cdphe.state.co.us/hs/medi...Changeform.pdf and said I would have to fill this out before the caregiver I assigned on my application could be changed.

So now I'm really confused.

Did I just screw myself or my "state caregiver"??

If I did, how do I fix this?

Thank you

I guess a good question to ask:

If they only allow one caregiver per patient, how would they know if a patient had multiple caregivers? and can anyone explain why you can not have multiple caregivers, specialy when it comes to something such cannabis?

When I go see my doctor, he dont tell me I can only fill my script at walgreens. I can fill it anywhere, from wal mart to the local grocery store....

PS: To cultivate a pouund of top notch medical grade cannabis usually costs me 900-1200 per pound depending on strain, and that is not factoring in labor. Once you add up what the setup costs, it usually takes one or two harvests to even recoupe your start up investment. Anyone who says they are doing pounds for 400, I would certainly like to hear the details surrounding it. I dont think even my outdoor could be produced that cheap....

If your original caregiver were to be investigated and relied upon your designation of him/her as your caregiver to account for part of the quantity of medicine and/or plants in his/her possession at the time the cops were standing there, then that person may not be exempt from prosecution, to the extent your designation of someone else became known to the authorities. To find out, the authorities would only have to make a phone call to the CDPHE. At least thats the way it is supposed to work. Clear as mud, right? Actually, it gets better. None of the foregoing means that your previous caregiver could not present an affirmative defense, presumably calling you as a witness to testify that notwithstanding your change of caregiver designation, he/she was still acting as your caregiver. Having to present any kind of defense is an expensive proposition however, and not for the faint of heart. Luckily, I am unaware of any legal limitation on the number of times you can change your designated caregiver on file with the CDPHE, so get the form and change it back if your previous caregiver still needs that designation.

The patient can obtain medicine anywhere they want, and as soon as it is in the patient's hand, it is legal under state law for them to possess it. It doesn't matter whether it is legal for the seller or not. If a cop were to interrupt the transaction while the medicine was still in the hands of the seller, and the seller did not have a license as a patient, (which I guess means it is still just pot instead of "medicine") the seller could be arrested, no matter who the buyer's designated caregiver is. There is no separate license to be a caregiver. The buyer's caregiver for a particular transaction is the seller, designated as such with the state or not, for purposes of making it legal for the patient. One of the anomalies of the law is the situation where a designated caregiver is not also licensed as a patient.

Sorry, I forgot. I believe the dispensary lied to you. You can only have either 1 or 0 caregivers designated with the CDPHE. You cannot add a caregiver, you can only change it. Note the language at the bottom of the form about revoking the previous caregiver (weird grammar, I thought only God could revoke someone). The more interesting issue is, how do you go from a caregiver to no caregiver?

Where does it say that a caregiver NEEDS a medical marijuana liscense? I dont understand why you would need to be sick to dispense medicine. From my understanding, patients can designate caregivers who do not actually consume the medicine, nor are patients.



It seems to me that they only ask you to register as a caregiver, but not actually require you to be a patient.


...Am I correct to believe this?

I love these dipsh@ts. Grow your own if you're so unhappy. Then they can worry about getting raided / robbed / shot / house burned down / bugs / mold / sh#tty seeds / hermaphrodites / cloning / cleaning / pruning / drying / packing / pulled over by some rookie cop / lawyers / court / everchanging laws / electric bills / ph balance / keeping their mouth shut so everyone in the world doesn't know / keeping the smell out of their house / watching what they say around their own home / wondering if their being watched / $2,000 start up expenses minimum . . . good luck ya fu#kin slackers. I'll charge you double or not at all if I one of you has the sack to bring up price around me.

There is no way to register as a caregiver, you can only BE registered as a caregiver by a patient.

bout time another person with a brain around here or should i say was raised right to earn your keep and not be a mooch.i thought i was the only one out there......

__________________
(loose lips sink ships):
(the only easy day was yesterday)
(u need to be wise and learn the art of shutup)
(one time this girl told me i was hung like a baby.........9p 3oz what can i say)
(if u can't hang wit the big boys then don't show up)
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." ~ Anonymous

im the guy everyone loves to hate, but knows is right.