SnSstealth, Well said!! Yes your pictures are great. They illustrate exactly what you are tring to acheive. This is not a grow show yet it's research, I think you will be proud of your results and quality but lack a little wieght. But hey hoo-doesn't want more potent smoke!! Congrates on where you are know and Good Luck In Your Future. Later

Any chance I could just get a couple quick quotes, thoughts or ideas as to why LED lighting would make more CB and THC. Could someone paraphrase so my 4-day long headache doesn't have to go hunting? Just 2 more days to break my record.

__________________

Maybe because more energy is absorbed in the right Wavelength's and allowing more time to creating CB and THC. Later

i wanted to get that light soooo bad but it was sooo expensive. i cant wait to see how your grow goes this is the first one iv seen with the procyon. if it realy produces like a 600w hps thatll change the game.

Mmmm nope, that aint it. Anything else?

For optimum efficiency a plant needs more than one or two wavelengths. More like somewhere between 15 and 100. We're just not sure yet.

__________________

i havent seen anything definitive about THC raising or taste or quality. i've read a few claims here and there...but that was what they were...i dont even think it was the HGL site that said it....so i cant answer your question either opie...cause i have no clue how it would.....lol

__________________
Your style will eventually match your grow area and the amount of time and money you like to put into initial setup vs. long term maintenance.-stinkyattic

LED growing- An instructional grow log
Episode 3...Revenge of the LED
Episode 4: The Clone Colonies

good on you for trying something new

you got any up to date pics of the lil ladies ?

__________________
If your afraid of looking stupid you'll never have any fun

"Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail"

"the way of the transgressor is hard"

If there is more resin, it might even be because something is missing. Which, in this case, would happen to be a good thing. Adding other colors might be counterproductive even.
Pure speculation, at this moment, but not watering a plant is meant to raise resin at the end of the plants cycle, too.

I can't remember if you are going to train the plants in some sort, LST, SCROG or keep them low as in a SOG, which I definitive would find beneficial (light penetration of the LEDs/ light fall off). No one would find that to be an unfair comparison to HID.

With those systems even two layers of LST-plants are possible where you can have only one with HID, since cooling and distance to the plants are a ruling factor, especially in cupboard grows.

But the most important thing is to have clear and straight grow. Don't fiddle about stuff, that can't be reproduced even by yourself.

Thumbs up, I'm reading this with pleasure.

Well i must say stealth, You are doing a very good job teaching any growers the benifits of LED Growing and i think everyone who is stating their opinions rudely should think again, what if this does work good and you get a massive yeild? everyone will be bowing to your feet asking for help and questions. I for one think thats very pacient of you to try something new and see the results. keep up the good work, ill be checkin up for photos of your little babes

Well I don't know about you guys but I have been intently following the LED reports in High Times. Basiclaly the problem with LED lights is the diodes that they are currently using. I know that the LED UFO uses 445 nm reds and 627 nm blues. (Problem with this info. The nm info is taken straight from High Times. Needless to say if you know anything about the color spectrum I believe they meant to put 445 blues and 627 reds since red happens at the higher end of the spectrum.) It says right in the article that they would LOVE to use 660 nm blues but they are WAY too expensive. I cannot speak for the Procyon 100 but the LED UFO will cause higher amounts/more potent resin but also a decreased yield and lots of stretching. Greatest absoprtion SPECIFICALLY for cannabis plants occurs at roughlt 425nm and 660nm. If you can find a way to provide 5000 lm per sq ft of 425nm and 660nm I can almost guarantee that you will get similiar results to that of HID lighting. In fact I am about to have a friend wire me up a board of 100-150 LEDs in those wavelengths. I am also going to try and find a few other wavelengths close to those just for a broader spectrum.

Buyers, don't be afraid to invest in some LED lights once you feel you are confident in them. The energy savings alone will pay for itself within a very short amount of time. I am telling you guys LEDs ARE the future

Great grow man lookin awesome.

__________________
Yeah, I smoke weed. . . Why? Well I just say to myself... What would Jesus do?

CFL Grow, just harvested check it out

wierd...still wont let me post pics, keeps saying server timed out.....blumen, I am getting 5000 lumen across the room at the top of the pots. and the procyon is a lil bit stronger than the UFO. the UFO is 90w and the procyon is 100. few more reds. im definitely considering SCROG depending on how the girls look in about 2 weeks. it could only help if im not quite getting enough light.

__________________
Your style will eventually match your grow area and the amount of time and money you like to put into initial setup vs. long term maintenance.-stinkyattic

LED growing- An instructional grow log
Episode 3...Revenge of the LED
Episode 4: The Clone Colonies

Paht....that's great but the future needs to get cheaper.

Sounds like you've really studied this LED thing as well. Hope you do a log too that everyone can follow.

__________________
Haze(y) Grow Log:
http://boards.cannabis.com/grow-log/...-grow-log.html

"Your deeds show your character."-StinkyAttic

Everyone keeps saying this and it's true, of course. If I run my furnace at 50 degrees instead of 70, there's no doubt doing that will pay for itself very shortly. If I drive a Yugo, or Le Car instead of my 4x4 truck, that would soon pay for itself too. Fuck that noise, I don't want to freeze, I like big powerful vehicles, and I like my weed yields to be as large as possible, no matter what the savings are for smaller yields. These things that are less productive and less expensive to operate are great for some people. Personally I'll do what I can to increase yield.

Do LED's cost less to run? Yes, much less. Do you get less weed using LED's? Yes, much less, unless you use about $5000 worth of light per plant. I hope I'm not bursting your bubble too much, but you're going to need about 10 or 15 of those 100-150 light arrays you are building, per plant, to see much of anything during flowering. If you've got the funds to try experiments, great. Good for you, but considering today's technology, it doesn't exactly make financial sense unless yield is not a concern for you.

Don't forget laws of physics people. Many have tried, and all have failed, to get more energy out of something than is put in.

__________________

Well I see his point if he just wants to see what they do and that makes sense. But I have to admit that the whole "taking one for the team" spirit confuses me a little in that I'm not exactly sure my team needed one taken.......

__________________
Haze(y) Grow Log:
http://boards.cannabis.com/grow-log/...-grow-log.html

"Your deeds show your character."-StinkyAttic

I disagree I think given the right wavelengths and at least 5,000 lumens per sq ft you could get as good of yields if not better than HID. There are HO LEDs that can put out over 130 lumens per watt. Order some 2 or 3 watt LEDs and fill a board with them. Yes it will be very expensive so if you want to start cheap then don't go LED. If you are looking to make/save more money in the long run LEDs are the way to go.

__________________
Yeah, I smoke weed. . . Why? Well I just say to myself... What would Jesus do?

CFL Grow, just harvested check it out

You can't compare a Procyon 100 OR a UFO LED to an HID lamp because they are both slightly if not way out of the spectrum that is needed for cannabis plants. The key to growing with LEDs since they can't yet match the lumens of an HID and still remain REASONABLY cost efficient is to hit precisely the spectrum needed for optimal growth. The Procyon 100 uses 40 635nm and 16 470nm CREE XLamp LEDs. The UFO LED lamp uses 20 455nm and 70 627nm of an unknown brand, at least to me, 1 watt LED. The light absorption by cannabis PEAKS at roughly 660 nm in the red at 90% absorption percentage in photosynthesis and 640 nm at 80% and 430 nm in the blue at 100% absorption percentage in photosynthesis and 465 nm at 80%. Now this is the combined photosynthesis of all pigments, chlorophyll-a,-b, and carotenoids. The indiviual pigments peak at 440nm at 64% and 660nm at 50% for -a, 465nm at 80% and 640nm at 30% for -b, and 445nm at 60% and 485nm at 58% for carotenoids. The advantage of LEDs is that you can get the EXACT spectrum you need where as with HID lamps you have a broader spectrum so you are wasting some of your lumens since they aren't usable in photosynthesis. I Haven't priced these specific LEDs needed. I am not worried about that right now but you can all expect to see an LED based grow soon. I would love to team up with some of you HID growers out there for some dual grows or something to have a variable.

Peace, one love

__________________
Yeah, I smoke weed. . . Why? Well I just say to myself... What would Jesus do?

CFL Grow, just harvested check it out

Try reducing the resolution size in your pics. (640x480)..the smaller size is easier to see here too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paht_Hed I think given the right wavelengths and at least 5,000 lumens per sq ft you could get as good of yields if not better than HID.

But at what cost, my dear man? Have you no conscience? Think of the lost lives!

I mean, I sure hope so, as I've said many times. No but really, at what cost to encase the plant in the light you speak of, and end up with some beauties?

Unfortunately it aint that simple. Please don't get me wrong, some of you guys seem fairly knowledgeable on the subject, and thanks for spending the time and money so we don't have to.

There are so many things to consider and study. I started, and I was all excited. I had no doubt that I was going to be the first one to come up with the exact perfect combination, since it didn't really seem like anyone else was interested in trying. Soon I began to realize that there is soooo much to study and learn, and a shitload of experiments that need to be done before even deciding what color LEDs to order. Oh yeah, I nearly forgot to mention the fact that in no way could I afford to make prototypes or even conduct necessary experiments. I needed plants, and I needed barrels of test LEDs. After a couple months of studying in some of my spare time, interest waned, at least in the dream of building my LED lighting empire. It’s still there, over in the corner in a box with some clothes on it, but I shut out it’s muffled pleas to be released. I don’t feel comfortable divulging the entire contents of the box at this time. As far as I know, some of the things in there are completely unique to the collection of grow LED ideas. I just thought it might be best to remove the temptation of borrowing part of one of my ideas for financial gain or dots of rep. Who knows? The box my spring a leak some day. Now, you guys have a go, and more power to you. And here’s some damn good advice, at least from my point of view: Try to think about some things you haven’t previously.

In this thread and others I’ve said that I want you guys/gals to succeed, and hopefully within the next couple 3 years. I’ve also said several times that I’ve yet to see a side by side study in which the LED side came anywhere close. Please link me if someone else has.

And Phat, 5,000 lumens. How far from the plant? Lumens is a measurement of the light people see, not plants. But I’m sure you knew that. Is that close to what the plant sees at those nm?

So an array produces light at a hypothetical distance of 2 feet. It produces 8x as much light at 1 foot, and 16x as much at ½ foot. Is that how the inverse square law works? (been awhile). Hypothetically it’s not producing enough light for the nice big dripping pieces of corn on the cob that you were hoping for, so you move it to 1 foot. OK good. That’s getting results much closer to what you had in mind since it’s getting 8 times more light. Oops, but where did the buds go on the surrounding areas of the grow? They nearly stopped growing, darn it. Since the manufacturer wanted to claim more light output than the competitor, they decided to use a 15 degree dispersal instead of 30. Sure glad that helps, but you have to go buy (incidentally exactly) 8 times more arrays to surround the one you lowered, so that all the plants can get light. So we’ve gone from what $500, up to $4000? Aaaaallright! Awesome, that’s not too bad to hypothetically seem like a pioneering, cutting edge bad ass hero in the weed farming community. Uh oh. Damn it! Seems like this manufacture forgot that lights need a mixture of somewhere between 6 and 30 different reds to be as efficient as possible during flowering. Seems like they got the best test results during vegging and using blue lights, so that’s what most of their advertising and production efforts were concentrated on. So then you decide to get the lights from the other guys, since they advertise 30 degree bulbs for a wider coverage. It doesn’t take more than 10 minutes after you set them up to realize that since the light is spread out twice as much, the grow is going to need twice as many to get the same amount of light. I’ll let you guys deal with this and much more.

NOTE: HYPOTHETICAL SITUATION EXAGGERATED FOR ILLUSTRATION PURPOSES.

__________________

[QUOTE=Opie Yutts;1800009]

And Phat, 5,000 lumens. How far from the plant? Lumens is a measurement of the light people see, not plants. But I’m sure you knew that. Is that close to what the plant sees at those nm?

-----------

5000 lm @ 16" to 18" with 2'x7' coverage=$1822 not 4000. (2' wide because of walls)

Just telling you what the tester reads if you think i'm wrong so be it.

__________________
Your style will eventually match your grow area and the amount of time and money you like to put into initial setup vs. long term maintenance.-stinkyattic

LED growing- An instructional grow log
Episode 3...Revenge of the LED
Episode 4: The Clone Colonies

Opie Yutts, What's up? Wavelenght's-is plural. Meaning many, There are 16.2 Billion different Colours you can blend with a LED!!! The extra energy from the correct spectrum is stored and then turns to suger which turn's to CB-THC. That's Botany 101. Later

opie the only link I can give you is to go to your local magazine shop and purchase this months issue of Hightimes magazine.
i dont have it in front of me but they do three separate grows with the UFO compared to a 400mh, a 400 hps and a 600 hps. and they CLAIMED that it produced around the same as the 400 hps. That is all i know. maybe you can get it at there site

Doughboy

__________________
Your style will eventually match your grow area and the amount of time and money you like to put into initial setup vs. long term maintenance.-stinkyattic

LED growing- An instructional grow log
Episode 3...Revenge of the LED
Episode 4: The Clone Colonies

What do you mean they claimed? Don't you get to see pictures or something? Could someone please scan the comparison photos and post them here so that I may, for my first time ever, see an all LED grow that rivals HID? And this is weed, right? I'm not interested in tomatoes or peppers. The nearest High Times is a 2 hour drive.

__________________

What extra energy are you talking about? Where in that spectrum did it come from, as opposed the the same spectrum in an HID lamp, or a CFL? And which one is the correct spectrum? Lil confused over here. I didn't know that had been discovered yet.

__________________

But I was talking about the amount of light that it takes to get those huge dense colas we sometimes see pictures of and rarely get to grow. = $4000.

__________________

ill see if i can get them up for ya opie...it spread over 3 issues....anyone else having problems doing pics last few days

__________________
Your style will eventually match your grow area and the amount of time and money you like to put into initial setup vs. long term maintenance.-stinkyattic

LED growing- An instructional grow log
Episode 3...Revenge of the LED
Episode 4: The Clone Colonies