I'm sorry to post this question, I tried to search but the term "PH" is too short for the boards search function...

I'm having to PH Up my nutes more frequently as my plants grow. I'm wondering if this is considered normal, or if it is indicitive of any actual problems etc.

I only use 8 to 10 gallons or so total (going to change it out and measure carefully today) and the plants are only about 10 inches tall, on their 8th node.

I calibrated my continuous meter yesterday, and PH Up'd to 5.8, this morning it was 5.3 so I upped it back to 6.0 (couple drops too many, oops) and it's down to 5.9 already, only 2 hours later.

Any input on PH dropping appreciated, thanks.

Don't know Mr E, mine usually goes up as the plants get bigger. Only time i've had ph probs too low was when using new medium that I didn't rinse super well. You use RO water right?

Yes I use RO water, some calmag as recommended (a little less than 5ml/gal actually), and weak gh 3 part nutrients. 5ml each per gallon currently.

I recently added a 400wMH and my water temp has gone up too high, does that create a PH issue?

My plan already for today is to drain the system, relocate my res to a new location which I've tested as several degrees cooler. But I dont know if thats related to ph. I also planned to go to latewoods feeding schedule which will be somewhat stronger nutrients.

I'm also still dealing with the brown spotted leaf issue which I'd hoped had been corrected but it's still showing up. Red stems also. I know these could be related to nutrient lockout due to HIGH PH, but what about low? Yargh too many questions.

There is a range for ph...I believe it is 5.5 to about 6.2 but I'm sure others know better....anything outside the range will cause nute lockout......I'm sure 5.3 is dropping too low...no clues why it would be dropping like that.....sorry....

I would try the stronger nutes--latewood's formula too if you have run the other gamut--and it sure sounds like you have. I actually plan to try it myself next grow....i did have problems at one point not using ENOUGH nutes...can't remember if I told you about it......age...senility.....good luck

Thanks, Weedhound. Yeah I have the chart for the various nutrients and their proper ph ranges etc. and have been keeping it at 5.8 as perfectly as I can. This rapid dropping thing is a new one.

It's at 5.7 now.

When I rearrange my room this evening, I'll raise up my grow tub a few inches so the system will hold overall a bit more water. Should make it more stable in general, and keep water temps cooler too.

Despite it all, the plants are doing well, crowding each other, showing pre-flowers and starting to give me a nice smell

Well for anyone following along, I've rearranged my room to place my res in a cool corner compared to the hot spot it was at (my water temp would start around 68 degrees and climb to over 75 through the day, and I didnt like that). The temp at the ground level next to the res is 68 degrees. Looks like the right spot.

I raised my growtup up on 2 old phonebooks that were slated for recycling. Procrastination pays off! This allowed me to add about 2 more gallons total to my system, which should also help keep numbers more stable for longer, and temps lower. The exact volume is now 10 gallons. Perfect easy number!

I took a plastic straw and put it straight down into my res, and marked the waterline with a rubberband so now I can check water level very simply.

Based on my water volume and using the "latewood formula", I've come up with these numbers for Vegetative growth:

NUTES*: 10 gallon@8ml/gal = 80ml (1/4 cup + 1.44 tblsp)
*this is for EACH of GH 3 part. Flora, Micro and Bloom.

CALMAG+: 10 gallon@3ml/gal = 30ml (2.08 tblsp)

I've released my attic hatch which allows the warm air to vent naturally, and the ambient room temperature at the canopy top is now at 77 degrees. 400watt lamp is about 14 inches above canopy, and I have cool white flourescent shoplight as side lighting.

As to the PH, it's currently at 6.0 with the plain RO water. I'll nute and supplement it in the morning with the exact numbers above and monitor through the day. PPM is currently at 20.

If any of this sounds wrong or anything, let me know.

Thanks for watching! hehe

I'll be interested to see what it is in the am before you add nutes etc...

Hi Weedhound, this morning the ph was still at exactly 6.0, and ppm still at 20.

I've added the 3 part nutrients to my res a few minutes ago, and after an hour or so it should be fully circulated in my system.

After adding nutes, the PH dropped to 4.8. I know I'll need to PH Up it after it's fully circulated. We'll see just how much later on.

Mine always drops when I first add nutes too and I have to adjust up. Will be keeping an eye out for updates...

damn mr.E ,
i was always in a constant fight to keep ph from rising not dropping . i don't have the luxury of r/o water tho . no clue w/ this 1 .
peace
crispi

Yeah that was strange. Maybe it was due to some rapid growth, or heck if I know.. RO water is nice. cheaphydroponics.com sells filters now. You just need a faucet adapter (can get one anywhere, same as a waterbed hose adapter)

At the moment, I've PH Up'd to 5.8 and it's stable for now. It took a few ml to get there. My PPM is at 1400, which is the highest by far it's ever been. Maybe I've been underfeeding them. I have been very light on nutes for fear of doing harm.

These are the reasons I started with the freebie seeds and not the "good" ones.

We'll see how it goes.

mr.E ,
yep joe at cheaphydro has shown me some real love . i get quite a bit there that i can't find locally .
crispi

odd, odd...keep us updated....keep an eye for overfert if you are jumping up numbers quick....damn numbers (actually I love them.....hydro.....right x?)

Yes I am keeping a close eye.. The newest leaves are more light green and I'm afraid they're droopy. They also feel somewhat stiff. This is a sign of N overfert?
Good god this is picky stuff.
I'm going to let it go overnight at least and try to note any growth or changes carefully.

N overfert usually shows as a beautiful dark dark green in the plant which I have done personally.....the only other fert probs I had were 1. not using enough Cal Mag which caused some sort of MG def or something.....leaves were green but veins were yellow....stopped right away when I went to 50% Cal Mag with my nutes as suggested by my hydro guy (he told me to use 50 and 50 Cal Mag and nutes until I got to the top of the Cal Mag scale which I really havent' done yet...I use that all the way through flower) and when I went too low on the nutes...caused an iron def or something....the whole plant wilted down in about 24 hrs but came back w/higher nute level. None of these sound like your problem however.

keep us in the know....

Wow...My 3-part buffers right to 5.8-5.9 with ro water...Did you mess witht the calibiration on your pen? Using 3-part and calmag with rowater...You shouldn't have any problems like that, and NO...the temps don't affect ph, as far as I know.
I'll look in later. yellow is usually too low salts, but if you are following my recipe, then there is no way you are nute deficient or toxic...I can promise you that!

Hi latewood. No I calibrated it just before this res change in fact. I'm extremely careful with that and it was perfect 4.0 and 7.0 when I was done. Plus the plain RO water was dead on 6.0 all night until morning when I nuted.

Could the fact that I used rapid rooters directly in the hydroton make any difference? I never added any water to them from the get go, as they lived up to their name. I've not noticed any material in the res either.

I make a point to shake the bottles well before adding the nutes also, and I add them micro, gro, bloom in that order directly to the res and stir each before the other (plus my water pump in the res stirs constantly and streams into the grow tub).

Since the change and adding the ph up, it's been pretty steady at 5.8. I havent had to readjust it at all.

The plants looked better (and smelled more) this morning. Last night 5 minutes before lights out, I very lightly misted the tops with straight RO water.

What about the old empty milk gallon jugs I use to store water? I rinse them and wash the hell out of them and rinse several more times and let air dry before using them for RO water. Is that a huge issue? I've never seen it mentioned, but trying to cover everything. My filter is close enough to the res where I could actually fill it directly that way, but it'd take several hours.

These issues all started before I started using your formula, so I'm sure it's nothing to do with that. The branch growth is great on these things, especially since they're so squat. Odd though that the shop I got the seeds says this strain likes to grow super tall. I think most of these things have to do with my inexperience with hydro, and starting them with my hard as nails tap water.

Help.. Im having problems with my ph dropping while in the trays. The reservoir is at 5.8 and when I measure in the tray durring watering it reads 3.6 also have yellowing leaves and stunted growth. Doing ebb flow and RO water, water temp 78 degrees. Tray just cleaned 2 weeks ago.

Mister E In answer to milkjugs...check water ph before, and a day after put into jugs...you tell us...Is the ph different?

I don't know what would cause the rez to read 5.8, and then 3.6 in tray???

keep us updated Mr E!!

Ok I'll try to update.

The PH of the plain RO water is 6.0 all around. So I'd say my containers are clean and neutral and not affecting PH since I fill them all week long at various times, then into the fridge until needed.

My PH since the res change has stayed at 5.8 since I adjusted it up after adding nutrients.

Since then, I've decided most of my new issues (stiff feeling, downward curving new growth, burned tips) were due to too strong nutrients. My plants may be too young for such a strong (1400+ppm) mixture. So I dipped a clean bucket in and removed about 2 gallons, and replaced with 2 gallons of plain RO water. PPM is now at 1110.

I also took a closer peek inside my grow tub and I decided some of the curl could have been due to "overwatering" maybe? I raised up my growtub another inch and a half or so.. Allowing me to keep the same capacity, just a bit lower water level.

The new growth seems more consistent now, and is not curling down. The branch growth is still very good, one decided to be a triple noded branch. Fine by me, lol.

I *still* have the issue of brown spots (yellowish in the center with a distinct darker brown/rusty border). Spots begin near tips and work their way inwards towards the stem basically. A few leaves have crisped right up. Mid level large fan leaves.

Incidently, if I started again today I'd leave only 1 plant per 10 gallon tub. There's simply not enough room between the plants unless you train them away from each other immediately. Clearly, 5 gallon buckets are the way to go with DWC unless you're going to be training your plants with a firm hand.

I have a much harder time keeping pH consistent with RO water then with water out of the tap. With 18-20 gallon bubblers, I have to adjust pH down every day. The larger the reservoir, the less it needs to be pHed. This is one of the reasons I went with a large recirculating dwc settup. Complicated to setup, theoretically easy to maintain.

PS. Having grown 2 to 4 plants per 20 gallon containers I will never put more then 2 per 20 gallon container and I will train them away from eachother. DWC has explosive growth. I was given a 4 plant 20 gallon bubbler and it was a dissaster, even after flowering immediatly from clone.

Yeah, I also made a recirculating system. Water pump in the res, 1/4" line to the grow tub streaming water 24 hours. It's the only way to be sure everything stays moving.

Mine is just miniature compared to yours. 18 gallon res, 10 gallon grow, 10 gallons total water. 1 airstone in the res, and 1 airstone beneath each plant.

RO water has no PH buffers, so it takes only tiny drops to adjust up/down, but it potentially fluctuates more up/down by the same token. Think so anyway.