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Thread: 1000w HPS covers an area of?

  1. #1
    tekneeqs's Avatar
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    1000w HPS covers an area of?

    Hi,

    Just a quick question. What is the space to be used with a 1000w HPS light?

    I'm asking because I was wondering how much of these lamps I'd need to cover a space of 11x10.
    Remember to bring a towel!!

  2. #2
    invision's Avatar
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    a space that big would need 4-6 lamps i believe they do a 3x3 area

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    BOYZNUS's Avatar
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    I HAVE 2 1000W HPS COVERING 18 PLANTS WITH A 6'X12' FOOTPRINT.

    PLANTS ARE IN 3 GALLON POTS.

    LIGHTS ARE 3' APART.
    Any posts made by me are purely fictional in nature and by no means is anything I say to be taken seriously. I do not grow or condone the growing of anything not legal. Any and all pictures I post are pictures widley available on the internet and any discussions I am involved in are purely hypothetical or are commentary in nature and should not constitute advice or be considered advice to assist in activities that are deemed illegal.

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    BOYZNUS's Avatar
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    I ALSO HAVE A 1000W MH IN A 3.5'X6' VEG ROOM.

    WHITE WALLS MAKES THE DIFF
    Any posts made by me are purely fictional in nature and by no means is anything I say to be taken seriously. I do not grow or condone the growing of anything not legal. Any and all pictures I post are pictures widley available on the internet and any discussions I am involved in are purely hypothetical or are commentary in nature and should not constitute advice or be considered advice to assist in activities that are deemed illegal.

  5. #5
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    it kinda depends on what type of hood or reflector your using .
    are you trying to grow the entire 11 x 12 or is that just the rooms dimensions ? thinking big is cool but leave yourself enuf room to move around n work . my rooms 11 x 12 too and w/ cooltubes i think i can cover about a
    6 x 10 ft. aera effectivly .
    peace
    crispi

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    CaliJay's Avatar
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    Stop what your doing and read this and remember. I messed around trying to get more production out of my 1000s. After reading some threads saying their 1000s were at 10 inches and 18 inches I lowered mine. Also pumped up nutes to 1400ppm from 1200....End result fan leaves burned as fuck!
    Did some research...If you have a good reflector you light should never be closer that 3 ft. It is pointless you have all the lumens you plant can take. Raise your hood and get better diffusion from refracted light and a larger footprint. 1000s are rated for 6x6 area. I use 4x4 tubs and the plants end up at 5x5. I use PL lights that have incredible coverage and light distribution. under the center of the light reads the same foot candle readings as the corner of the grow area.
    If you feel like burning your plants lower your lights.

    Disclaimer..you could run more airflow & keep the room cooler & keep nutes lower than normal & shut off Co2....etc but why? Your plants want uniform lighting and that is achieved through distance and refraction. That is an argument for running "less effecient" 1000s instead of 600s.

    Drawback...height restrictions...

    Good luck friends.. -J
    Good weed comes from happy plants..and happy plants come from CALIFORNIA


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    you know how stoners operate...

    1. get an idea
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    6. smoke more weed
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    bejay is offline Registered+
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    in general most will cover a 4 by 4 or 4 by 5 area effectivly but it does vary with different reflectors as per the light being 3 ft away from the plants that is to far away, and while you should make use of refracted light by using mylar or something similiar on the walls.

  8. #8
    dusto2k3's Avatar
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    i flowre w/ a 1k HPS in a 4x4 (feet) area
    "I might be an idiot, but I'm not stupid." - Self

    "man who goes to bed with ichy bum wakes up with smelly finger" - xxxhazexxx

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    Garden Knowm's Avatar
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    The buds that are grown with a light 12 inches away from the canopy look nothing like the buds that are grown at 36 inches away..

    If you can not keep the temp down or cool the canopy then raising your lights may be your only HOPE...

    But if you want forearm sized buds and actually get your monies worth from your electricity bill, the lights often need to be no higher than 12-18 inches...

    A 1000 watt HPS with no C02 should yield 2lbs... This requires adequate ventilation and perfect light proximity..

    A 1000 watt bulb can do a great job on a 3 X 3 grow space....

    After that, the lumens are being compromised...

    and NOW you KNOWM

    attached are 2 pictures of a grow room with 2 - 1000 watt HPS bulbs on a light mover that are never more than 4 inches from the canopy...

    iloveyou
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 1000w HPS covers an area of?-flower-room-2.jpg   1000w HPS covers an area of?-flower-rooom.jpg  
    GARDEN KNOWM

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  10. #10
    dusto2k3's Avatar
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    Knowm, Why the hatchet zip-tied to the 2x4 with tape on the blade?
    "I might be an idiot, but I'm not stupid." - Self

    "man who goes to bed with ichy bum wakes up with smelly finger" - xxxhazexxx

  11. #11
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    I have a 1kw in a cool tube only like 12 inches above the tops of my plants. I just had to raise it to 18" tho, since the plants are bigger. Only 4 plants under my 1kw......that will change next time. 4 big plants tho, 2.5 months of veg w/ lots of LST'ing
    Quote Originally Posted by lizard_king
    i think at one point i might have fed my plant sprite : (
    w00t, finally harvested (01/12/07) 14.6 oz wet

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    Quote Originally Posted by dusto2k3 View Post
    Knowm, Why the hatchet zip-tied to the 2x4 with tape on the blade?
    not positive but i think he uses it for balance?...could be wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by CaliJay View Post
    Stop what your doing and read this and remember. I messed around trying to get more production out of my 1000s. After reading some threads saying their 1000s were at 10 inches and 18 inches I lowered mine. Also pumped up nutes to 1400ppm from 1200....End result fan leaves burned as fuck!
    Did some research...If you have a good reflector you light should never be closer that 3 ft. It is pointless you have all the lumens you plant can take. Raise your hood and get better diffusion from refracted light and a larger footprint. 1000s are rated for 6x6 area. I use 4x4 tubs and the plants end up at 5x5. I use PL lights that have incredible coverage and light distribution. under the center of the light reads the same foot candle readings as the corner of the grow area.
    If you feel like burning your plants lower your lights.

    Disclaimer..you could run more airflow & keep the room cooler & keep nutes lower than normal & shut off Co2....etc but why? Your plants want uniform lighting and that is achieved through distance and refraction. That is an argument for running "less effecient" 1000s instead of 600s.

    Drawback...height restrictions...

    Good luck friends.. -J
    I 100% disagree with this statement. Every single ounce of my experience and everything I have been taught has shown me that you cannot go above 12" (16 if your having major heat issues that you just cannot solve right now). But 3 feet? Are you out of your mind?

    2 identical rooms. One with lights 12" above the canopy. One with lights 36" above the canopy. Are you actually going to still say that the room with the lamps 36" above the canopy is going to produce the SAME amount of yield and JUST as big of nugs? No, your not...and if you do then your speaking from internet research and not personal experience.

    In my opinion and from my own experience, you never want more then a 4x4 area on a 1000 watt. Me personally? I think you should never even go past 3x3 area. If your having trouble with burning your plants, then its not an issue of the lights being to close. Its an issue of you not providing proper ventillation, proper temperatures, proper circulation, and proper nutes. I let my plants get within 4" of my 600 digitals and they do not burn. If you want to go for a ton of smaller buds that will end up weighing less then by all means, lift the lamp way up to light more area. But you are drastically lowering lumens at an exponential rate and your losing watts/square foot and lumens/square foot.

    In the 80s people lit 8x8 areas with a 1000 watt. This is the 21st century.

    PS. Wanted to add that a lot of "ratings" are not for growing our specific plant of choice. When your growing peppers and tomatoes, its not nearly as much of an impact (but still an impact none the less) to have the light much farther away for a larger area. Also...if you get the light close and you dont like the light spread, then get a different hood that spreads it out more so you can utilize it better without losing lumens.
    Last edited by Racerx; Dec-15-2006 at 18:39.

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    Stylus is offline Registered+
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racerx View Post
    I 100% disagree with this statement. Every single ounce of my experience and everything I have been taught has shown me that you cannot go above 12" (16 if your having major heat issues that you just cannot solve right now). But 3 feet? Are you out of your mind?

    2 identical rooms. One with lights 12" above the canopy. One with lights 36" above the canopy. Are you actually going to still say that the room with the lamps 36" above the canopy is going to produce the SAME amount of yield and JUST as big of nugs? No, your not...and if you do then your speaking from internet research and not personal experience.

    In my opinion and from my own experience, you never want more then a 4x4 area on a 1000 watt. Me personally? I think you should never even go past 3x3 area. If your having trouble with burning your plants, then its not an issue of the lights being to close. Its an issue of you not providing proper ventillation, proper temperatures, proper circulation, and proper nutes. I let my plants get within 4" of my 600 digitals and they do not burn. If you want to go for a ton of smaller buds that will end up weighing less then by all means, lift the lamp way up to light more area. But you are drastically lowering lumens at an exponential rate and your losing watts/square foot and lumens/square foot.

    In the 80s people lit 8x8 areas with a 1000 watt. This is the 21st century.

    PS. Wanted to add that a lot of "ratings" are not for growing our specific plant of choice. When your growing peppers and tomatoes, its not nearly as much of an impact (but still an impact none the less) to have the light much farther away for a larger area. Also...if you get the light close and you dont like the light spread, then get a different hood that spreads it out more so you can utilize it better without losing lumens.
    BOO YAH!

  15. #15
    Garden Knowm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keeko View Post
    not positive but i think he uses it for balance?...could be wrong
    yes... not my grow... just one I filmed.. I would use a wrench.. not a hatchet.. LOL
    GARDEN KNOWM

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  16. #16
    Garden Knowm's Avatar
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    I also want to say that CALI is a great guyt that gives GREAT advice and although are comments may seem opposing they really are just different growing styles..

    BY NO means am I RIGHT...
    nor am I wrong...

    lol

    iloveyou
    GARDEN KNOWM

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    I am with Jorge on this one...Sorry guys :0(

    Aww thx Gnome...

    Ok....suckas, so you have inspiried me to once again check my fact on this one. In the interest of passing around reliable information I want to explain exactly where I got my info and let folks decide which info is more reliable. I also want to know if I am missing something?

    OK...Jorge Cervante's "Marijuana Horticulture the indoor/outdoor medical growers bible" Is the best book I have read on the subject of MJ. I don't think anyone that has read this book would say the information is not reliable. The facts are given and he explains why things are the way they are.(can you tell I like this book?) Anyway... Page 179 gives exact specs on how much light is distributed to your plants.

    The assumption is 140,000 lumens output by a 1000 watt bulb.(The Solarmax I use is rated at 147,000) The data shows that at 1 foot you get the full 140,000 l and it decreases as you get farther away. In a 16 foot area you get 62.5 watts/sqft which is arguably as much as is productive and you have reached diminishing returns. The line I was interested in was the 10,000 lumen line. Many say that 5500 lumens is the most MJ can use but Jorge and some others I have read say 9-10k lumens is max. The 1000 watt bulb delivers 10,000.....at 4ft away!!!! not 3 but 4 so anything over this is going to be overkill.

    On page 177 notes about coverage and distance are given. It says that a 1000 watt bulb "delivers enough light to illuminate a 6x6 area well" Mr Cervantes goes on to make the point that anything closer than a distance of 24 inches and you risk burning foliage.

    Page 187 details a "reflective hood study" that Jorge Cervantes did himself. Blacking out the entire room and creating a grid on the floor he took light reading at each intersecting grid point. The data he gathered revealed much variation in light intensity using different reflective hoods. The data did show that a good hood delivers 10,000 lumens in a wide pattern confirming his previous data.

    I like this book because the information is not only presented but how the information was gathered is presented as well. On these boards many opinions are given without any attention being paid as to where the info comes from.

    My opinion is formed from the data in this book as well as my own experience of burning my plants pretty bad after reading here that growers are putting their hoods at 10-18 inches. I lowered my PL air cooled sealed hoods to 15 inches and did the ever popular back of the hand test. I hung my humi/thermo meter at canopy height and kept the temp at 85-87 degrees because I'm running Co2. This setup began to curl leaf tips and burn entire leaves in 2 days. I didn't think the lamp would burn the plants if it was cool enough but it was burning them on a cellular level. Boiling and burstion the cells in the leaves. I moved the light and the leaves continued to brown and shrivel for 2 days as the ruptured cells dried up. (sad story huh? It's OK if you cry )

    Sooo It seems to me that variations in setups could be the reason that our view differ on this guys. I don't know if you are using budget equipment but what I know for certain is that with PL hoods and Solarmax bulbs you can definitly have your lights at 36 inches and achieve a larger useable footprint. If you listen to my homie Jorge you can get 6x6. There is a question of penetration that still remains though.

    I am interested to hear how you guys came to your conclusions about the topic. I will never stop learning and if there is something new out there I want to Gnome about it. Gnome? Stylus? RacerX? You have the conch

    BTW- Jorge Cervantes advocates using 600 watt lights rather than 1000 to get better coverage for less dough. 600 watt lights allow you to lower your hoods closer to the canopy and save headroom.

    Peace and Love in the quest for truth- Jay
    Last edited by CaliJay; Dec-17-2006 at 05:28.
    Good weed comes from happy plants..and happy plants come from CALIFORNIA


    Quote - GardenKnome
    you know how stoners operate...

    1. get an idea
    2. act upon your idea
    3. re-consider what you already did
    4. go eat something
    5. wish you weren't so stoned so you could talk to the girl behind the counter at starbucks
    6. smoke more weed
    7. start at #1 again

  18. #18
    bejay is offline Registered+
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    there is lots of things that will affect lumens even glass in a cool tube or sealed reflector reduces lumen output, but at the same time it allows you to have the lights closer to the plants, even in a air cooled reflector without glass you should be able to keep the light no further than 2 ft away from the tops of the plants.
    it is all about penetration really lets say you are adequetly lighting the top of the plant at 3 ft away what about the rest of the plant seeing how you can take a just rooted clone and thow it into flowering and still end up with a plant well over 1 foot tall thats if you grew sog what if you veged for a while and had your plants end up at about 3 ft tall are you going to get good light penetration with the light 3 ft above the tops no you will not.
    in your original post you sayed you bumped up your nutes wich is probably what caused your leaves to curl instead of the lights being lowered.

  19. #19
    BlueBear's Avatar
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    "If what shone afar so grand,
    Turn to nothing in thy hand,
    On again; the virtue lies
    In struggle, not the prize."--R. M. Milnes.
    Hugh Miller said the only school in which he was properly taught
    was "that world-wide school in which toil and hardship are the
    severe but noble teachers."

  20. #20
    Garden Knowm's Avatar
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    Whenever I walk past a BUSH I notice that not even the almighty sun can penetrate past 1 inch of dense foilage.. the center of the bush is always dark and has zero leaves..


    iloveyou
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    bejay is offline Registered+
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    the sun may not be able to penetrate foilage or shaded areas but it does not lose its intensity like a light for every foot it loses half of its intensity.
    ok if you have 140,000 lumens at 1 ft away to begin with and you lose half its intensity for every foot away the light is and at 4 ft I get 17,500 lumens in a 16 sq ft garden with a 1000 watt lamp 4 ft away that would be 1094 lumens per sq ft.
    there is a link below that explains lumens and lights in more detail.
    http://www.hydroempire.com/store/hyd...osynthesis.php

  22. #22
    Garden Knowm's Avatar
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    YES BEJAY i agree!!! even more reason to keep the light CLOSE..

    iloveyou
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  23. #23
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    Studies prove the plant can only use 10,000 lumens. That was the point I was making. Why place the light closer even though it won't penetrate when you can get a wider footprint by raising it? You could then add more plants or spread apart the ones you have? I still have not seen any information other than opinion from anyone?
    Please take the time to show your sources of info rather than continuing the myths.

    I have been looking at pics of a lot of commercial grows with huge dense buds and the lights are ALWAYS about 36 in from what I can tell from the photos.

    BTW BJ...I admit that the nutes probably had something to do with the burning foliage. I believe I reversed the flow of water and drew out moisture from the plant at the same time as lowering my lights. It is possible that had my nutes been correct the plants would not have burned. I am a noob and am just trying to make sure I learn the lesson so I at least get something out of my screw up :0(

    Love -Jay
    Good weed comes from happy plants..and happy plants come from CALIFORNIA


    Quote - GardenKnome
    you know how stoners operate...

    1. get an idea
    2. act upon your idea
    3. re-consider what you already did
    4. go eat something
    5. wish you weren't so stoned so you could talk to the girl behind the counter at starbucks
    6. smoke more weed
    7. start at #1 again

  24. #24
    CaliJay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bejay View Post
    the sun may not be able to penetrate foilage or shaded areas but it does not lose its intensity like a light for every foot it loses half of its intensity.
    ok if you have 140,000 lumens at 1 ft away to begin with and you lose half its intensity for every foot away the light is and at 4 ft I get 17,500 lumens in a 16 sq ft garden with a 1000 watt lamp 4 ft away that would be 1094 lumens per sq ft.
    there is a link below that explains lumens and lights in more detail.
    http://www.hydroempire.com/store/hyd...osynthesis.php

    BJ you should check the math.

    Page 179. Marijuana Horticulture - Jorge Cervantes

    1000w 140 lumens per watt.

    1foot(30cm) 140,000 lumens
    2feet(60cm) 35,000
    3feet(90cm) 15,555
    4feet(120cm) 9999( this is your target. anything more is wasted)

    That is assuming you are not using a Solarmax or hortilux bulb which would be more lumens.

    10,000 lumens to your canopy at 4 feet. The light is also gives you better light distribution which equals a more even canopy.

    4x4 = 16sqft, 1000w / 16sqft = 62.5 watts per sqft.


    BJ please explain your grow show and it might explain your take on the subject? Are you closet growing? The facts are there for you all to see.

    Gnome? any data to support your point to keep lamps so close?

    Bear...Can you repost the link?

    Jay
    Last edited by CaliJay; Dec-19-2006 at 18:30.
    Good weed comes from happy plants..and happy plants come from CALIFORNIA


    Quote - GardenKnome
    you know how stoners operate...

    1. get an idea
    2. act upon your idea
    3. re-consider what you already did
    4. go eat something
    5. wish you weren't so stoned so you could talk to the girl behind the counter at starbucks
    6. smoke more weed
    7. start at #1 again

  25. #25
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    Well, CJ, I think that you are considering this in a logical way because of the fact that what your saying does make since, but at the same time, IMO you have to remember that you can easily find more documented grows in one day over the net than someone like ED or Green have seen in 2 years of going to places and though there knowledge is great, some of the principles are more general than specific IMO.
    I think that when you look at the 100 of grows on the different boards and follow the grows where people are getting the kolas as big as your head that you will see that indeed they are faithfully bringing lights as close as possible. For every 1 grow that you might find where a person is getting killer harvests with lights 36 inches away you could find about 20 or more where there getting them with the lights closer. Also, I believe that you may achieve similar results with some different growing styles having lights further away than 12 to 18 inches, but the knowledge that is needed to make up for the difference most do not possess, along with the other equipment that is needed to supplement the factor of the lights not being as close. Fore instance, look at tranables grow, he has the lights over 18 inches away I believe, but as you know by now he has all of the bells and whistles and a bucket of knowledge to go along with it and that is why his thread is the longest active thread around here, but do a quarter of people growing have his knowledge or equipment or the ability to use it if they did?? I think not. His grow is not typical in some ways, he even caught some slack over on OG for his style, but he proved them wrong as you can see with his results. But again, the man has his stuff down, but at the same time, in order to do a grow like him, with plant count numbers you are automatically put into the federal sentencing guide lines and would be facing a 10 year minimum for 2 of his tables and that doesn't include mothers and fresh cuttings. So using one grow to compare to dozens of other grows like the Crusty buckets where you can pull 3 pounds per plant with vertical lights sitting right on the plant, or KFB pulling 4 LB's off a plant or a BC grow I just read where they pulled 20LB off of 9 K of lights with 12 plants in a room that was 12x13 with some of the lights almost touching the leafs does not necessarily prove your findings in the way of real life experience, but rather more theory IMO, and I am not trying to knock the light studies, but rather pointing out real deal results.
    I remember you stating before that the friend who was mentoring you and gave you your clones was getting about an ounce per plant under a 1K in a ebb and flow and maybe getting a little under a LB, or maybe it was less, I can't remember and don't want to mis represent you, but any how if something like his yield with a WW cross is that low then I think you are perhaps used to seeing a different style of growing than some of the more advanced and yeh, sometimes anal growers. I mean, GK has a thread that has been floating around for almost a year where he showed I think 3 plants being grown out in MG with a ph of 8 for a while and I think only 3 watering for almost the first 3 weeks under CFL's and I believe the yield was almost 1/2 a LB and if someone in hydro with 16 or more plants can hardly double that then,,??? I will leave the rest to your imagination.
    Shallow Hal has a thread on here entitled, "What's in the flower room? And he is getting a ounce per plant throwing them into flower almost as soon as their rooted and I believe that his area is maybe 4x4 and he can put a couple dozen or more plants in there under 2 600W's if I understood him right, and he doesn't have any thing fancy going on in the way of inviermental controllers, not even a hydro grow, but rather coco.
    In summery, I guess that I just want to say that, experience does play a large part in growing, if people see there nuggs getting fat and tight with lights close and didn't see that when they were further, what should they do?? If people see 100's of grows where people are dropping the lights right on the plants and getting killer harvests, what would they try? I love you CJ and am not trying to knock you around just putting my thoughts out there and don't necessarily expect them to change your views, but figured that my opinions were as viable as anyone else's on this thread so I put them out there.
    Adieu and in the famous words of GK, Iloveyou
    "If what shone afar so grand,
    Turn to nothing in thy hand,
    On again; the virtue lies
    In struggle, not the prize."--R. M. Milnes.
    Hugh Miller said the only school in which he was properly taught
    was "that world-wide school in which toil and hardship are the
    severe but noble teachers."

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