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Thread: Leaves turning white

  1. #1
    metalarclemon's Avatar
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    Leaves turning white

    What is your experience level? experienced

    What type of hydro set-up are you running?

    This is a variation of flood & drain, the sytem consists of 2 6' 4"x4" pvc tubes, with 16 2" net cups with ez clone foam plugs no medium, spaced about 11" apart. Hortilux 1K on hydrofarm mover in a ventilated hood on a 12hr cycle about 14" from the canopy.


    Your nutrients and water:

    I am using Botanicare nutes, at 1400ppm and a ph of 6.0, tap water with a base ppm of 100, 18 gal res with air bubbler, 396gph pump, water at 75F, no foliar feeding, no ph or ppm fluctuations.

    Your growroom:

    this is a 12x14 room, fresh air intake, lights exhausted, 68F lights out, 78-80F lights on, nice roots, 35% humidity, no signs of any pests.

    Your strain:

    Sensi Seeds Super Skunk, fast finisher and vigorous growth. Ordered 2 fem seeds both fem and have same pheno & grow characteristics. all grows are from clone.


    The problem (I say problem loosely) is only on one branch of 1 plant out of 16 sharing the same nutes light etc. there are a few fan leaves that are bleach white on half of the leaf from the margin over and on one the far 2 blades are white and now one closer to the top is starting to bleach at one half. There really is no adverse efffects yet, but they are only at day 11 of flowering and don't want it to get out of hand. The wierd part is that only the one branch on the one plant is doing it. It's sharing root space with all the plants around it, matter of fact all the roots are intermingled at this point so I am at a loss. all the clones are from the same plant as well. At first I thought I may have gotten some nutes on it as it was only on 1 leaf and is perfectly white. now there are 3 leaves total with some white on them. I have never seen this before in many years and is quite baffling as this has been a trouble free very tasty strain so far. I would post pics but my junk hp digital camera decided to give up on me, maybe later. Any help or suggestions will be appreciated.

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    Faddenator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by metalarclemon View Post
    What is your experience level? experienced

    What type of hydro set-up are you running?

    This is a variation of flood & drain, the sytem consists of 2 6' 4"x4" pvc tubes, with 16 2" net cups with ez clone foam plugs no medium, spaced about 11" apart. Hortilux 1K on hydrofarm mover in a ventilated hood on a 12hr cycle about 14" from the canopy.


    Your nutrients and water:

    I am using Botanicare nutes, at 1400ppm and a ph of 6.0, tap water with a base ppm of 100, 18 gal res with air bubbler, 396gph pump, water at 75F, no foliar feeding, no ph or ppm fluctuations.

    Your growroom:

    this is a 12x14 room, fresh air intake, lights exhausted, 68F lights out, 78-80F lights on, nice roots, 35% humidity, no signs of any pests.

    Your strain:

    Sensi Seeds Super Skunk, fast finisher and vigorous growth. Ordered 2 fem seeds both fem and have same pheno & grow characteristics. all grows are from clone.


    The problem (I say problem loosely) is only on one branch of 1 plant out of 16 sharing the same nutes light etc. there are a few fan leaves that are bleach white on half of the leaf from the margin over and on one the far 2 blades are white and now one closer to the top is starting to bleach at one half. There really is no adverse efffects yet, but they are only at day 11 of flowering and don't want it to get out of hand. The wierd part is that only the one branch on the one plant is doing it. It's sharing root space with all the plants around it, matter of fact all the roots are intermingled at this point so I am at a loss. all the clones are from the same plant as well. At first I thought I may have gotten some nutes on it as it was only on 1 leaf and is perfectly white. now there are 3 leaves total with some white on them. I have never seen this before in many years and is quite baffling as this has been a trouble free very tasty strain so far. I would post pics but my junk hp digital camera decided to give up on me, maybe later. Any help or suggestions will be appreciated.
    Never had this happen, but I believe your plant is just showing signs of albinoism... from what I can gather it wont affect the plant, just the color of a few leaves. I'm not sure if it actually is a problem though.

    maybe somebody else knows about albinoism?
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    Just an update, here are pics of the mysterious white leaves. As you can see by the second pic everything is going fine at day 21 of flower and you could never tell which plant had the white leaves now that I plucked them. I never saw this before and thought I'd save someone some worry if they ever see the same thing. They are just mutants and were healthy until I took them off and grew to full size. This was only on 1 branch of 1 plant of 21 clones taken from the same mother. So if you see this just keep on truckin because it caused no harm, just odd looking as they really are white.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Leaves turning white-016.jpg   Leaves turning white-017.jpg  

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    Might be time to switch to an all-fabric bleach?

    I'm not a hydro guy, but is this a progression, or did they just appear that way overnight? Is there any indication on new growth? I know they are tangled, but have you carefully checked it's rootball for damage, black or brown spots or slime? Yellowing leaves I could understand, but white isn't a normal color found on cannabis. Roots, yes. Foliage, no.

    Were they bagseed, I'd mention that DJ Shorts is offering a variegated Blueberry strain. Perhaps of the same basic lineage? Perhaps a result of decades of uncoltrolled cross breeding...? Perhaps a new strain of killer quality and flavor...? Perhaps spilled nutes or splashed phosphoric acid...?

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    The plant first showed just a part of a white leaf about 6 days into flower and then as the plant grew 2 more leaves showed the same trait once they reached their current level of whiteness they just progressed as normal. I thought I had spilled something as well, but as I saw new leaves grow after the first with the same thing I knew it wasnt that. It's sensi seeds super skunk.

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    Thumbs up I like it.!

    Sounded like light bleach until you posted a picture.
    It looks like a genetic "hiccup".

    Close up pic, might make a nice T-shirt.

    Aloha,
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    Mix-up's do happen. Could you search for examples of DJ Shorts Blueberry line, and see if the growth habits and breeder description are similar to your plant? Not sure I've seen any growlogs for his Blueberry in here, but ya never know...

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    What kind of LIGHTS?

    I light bleached these puppies...week #3 flowering. Using 400 watt CMH bulb...

    Once the white appeared on the fan leaves...it got worse and worse...VERY gradually...and the plants never recovered. After I chopped them down; after 8 weeks...I noticed the underside of the fan leaves was still green?...very strange.

    The buds never did show any change of color and the plants quit growing after 5 weeks. I guess?...I stayed too close, with the light?...and switching to HPS didn't help, either...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Leaves turning white-week-3-light-bleaching-001.jpg   Leaves turning white-switched-hps-001.jpg  

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Pimp View Post
    I light bleached these puppies...week #3 flowering. Using 400 watt CMH bulb...

    Once the white appeared on the fan leaves...it got worse and worse...VERY gradually...and the plants never recovered. After I chopped them down; after 8 weeks...I noticed the underside of the fan leaves was still green?...very strange.

    The buds never did show any change of color and the plants quit growing after 5 weeks. I guess?...I stayed too close, with the light?...and switching to HPS didn't help, either...
    Hortilux 1K. onna mover.


    Just took a closer look.
    That's not light bleach.
    The definition tween white and green is a sharp line.
    It's like the chlorophyl gene got switched off.
    Some kine bio-screwup.
    I've seen something similar with Lemonskunk clones, only it was bright yellow instead of white.

    Now, I wish I'd taken pics.

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  10. #10
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    Smile

    I agree...Weeze.....light bleaching is fairly rare. I'm suprised I figured out how to do that, in such a short time...

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    Weez is right, Dutch. Yours are yellow. not white. And yours almost looks like heat damage, or spraying the leaves and lowering the lights, (steamed leaves) or stabbing the roots with a stake. (perhaps a bamboo one, lol). Did you at some point accidentally brush the plant against the hot bulb?

    OP's photo's look like they never had chlorophyll to begin with.
    Never seen light bleaching from UV light, but there was no mention of UV light anyway...
    With a vented hood, (implying a glass barrier) a broken bulb envelope is ruled-out...
    Only thing it leaves me with is genetics. Or...someone is dicking with us and doctored their leaves or washed-out the yellowing with photoshop.
    Can we get a good picture of the white while still on the plant?

  12. #12
    Dutch Pimp's Avatar
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    Weez is right, Dutch. Yours are yellow. not white. And yours almost looks like heat damage, or spraying the leaves and lowering the lights, (steamed leaves) or stabbing the roots with a stake. (perhaps a bamboo one, lol). Did you at some point accidentally brush the plant against the hot bulb?
    Hi Rusty

    1. It looked snow white in person...and like I said earlier..it progressed very slowly over a 3 week period...during 2-5 week, 12/12 flowering cycle.
    The fan leaves were still green, on their undersides & and white/shriveled on top?

    2, The temps at ground level & light level, never went over 83 degrees...and I don't spray leaves.

    3. I do use a moisture probe to check for the next watering. I've used one since '05.

    4. I had them elevated (on a box) too close to the light; I am almost sure of that?...probably about 15 inches away. I did a have a small fan blowing between the plants and the light. One poster (at ICMag) thought it was 'wind burn'. I don't remember anybody reporting that before. They never came closer than 15 inches from the light. I switched to an HPS bulb; thinking it MIGHT be UVb related?..but, the situation never improved and got progressively worse.

    5. I drives me nuts, not knowing for sure......cause...I'm starting again.....week #3 veg...film at eleven...
    Last edited by Dutch Pimp; Feb-13-2010 at 10:02.

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    Quote Originally Posted by metalarclemon View Post
    The plant first showed just a part of a white leaf about 6 days into flower and then as the plant grew 2 more leaves showed the same trait once they reached their current level of whiteness they just progressed as normal. I thought I had spilled something as well, but as I saw new leaves grow after the first with the same thing I knew it wasnt that. It's sensi seeds super skunk.
    are the white leaves....white; top and bottom?..(undersides?)...if so? it's probably genetics...and I wouldn't sweat that.....since there's nothing that can be done about it.
    Last edited by Dutch Pimp; Feb-13-2010 at 10:17.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Pimp View Post
    Hi Rusty

    1. It looked snow white in person...and like I said earlier..it progressed very slowly over a 3 week period...during 2-5 week, 12/12 flowering cycle.
    The fan leaves were still green, on their undersides & and white/shriveled on top?

    2, The temps at ground level & light level, never went over 83 degrees...and I don't spray leaves.

    3. I do use a moisture probe to check for the next watering. I've used one since '05.

    4. I had them elevated (on a box) too close to the light; I am almost sure of that?...probably about 15 inches away. I did a have a small fan blowing between the plants and the light. One poster (at ICMag) thought it was 'wind burn'. I don't remember anybody reporting that before. They never came closer than 15 inches from the light. I switched to an HPS bulb; thinking it MIGHT be UVb related?..but, the situation never improved and got progressively worse.

    5. I drives me nuts, not knowing for sure......cause...I'm starting again.....week #3 veg...film at eleven...
    400watts and you bleached it from 15", i dont know about that. i get mine to about 12"-13" from the plants never had a problem unless they get closer then that. and you got to burn alot of leaves to stop growth, sounds more like some kind of a lockout.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maro69camaro View Post
    400watts and you bleached it from 15", i dont know about that. i get mine to about 12"-13" from the plants never had a problem unless they get closer then that. and you got to burn alot of leaves to stop growth, sounds more like some kind of a lockout.
    I agree with that possibility.......I just can't figure out how; that, nute lockout would only affect the top/middle fan leaves, first...only?..Look at the pics...the bottom leaves are unaffected...

    I only gave them one dose of 10-52-10 during this period. I've used this nute/dose since '05...without any problem?...and I flushed several times, trying to improve things.

    Thanks... for your input...'69er...
    Last edited by Dutch Pimp; Feb-13-2010 at 10:47.

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    Aphids?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Trichome View Post
    Weez is right, Dutch. Yours are yellow. not white. And yours almost looks like heat damage, or spraying the leaves and lowering the lights, (steamed leaves) or stabbing the roots with a stake. (perhaps a bamboo one, lol). Did you at some point accidentally brush the plant against the hot bulb?

    OP's photo's look like they never had chlorophyll to begin with.
    Never seen light bleaching from UV light, but there was no mention of UV light anyway...
    With a vented hood, (implying a glass barrier) a broken bulb envelope is ruled-out...
    Only thing it leaves me with is genetics. Or...someone is dicking with us and doctored their leaves or washed-out the yellowing with photoshop.
    Can we get a good picture of the white while still on the plant?
    Sorry those were the only pics I got of them. The leaves other than the color were perfectly healthy and were'nt dry, crispy, wilted or anything. Also I don't "dick" with people for no reason and those photos are untouched. While on the plant they were on one branch, one torwards the bottom, skip a few up with no probs then one more and up a few and the last one. The reason I posted this was because I could find nothing like them in any books I have or anywhere on the net, and figured as a help to others stressing about something like this not to worry and actually get some pics of these strange things up where people can see.

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    Unwad your panties a tad. Twasn't an accusation, it was simply another possibility, given the info we had in front of us.

    The reason there is a troubleshooting form, is that quite a few growers that are having problems or annomalys don't know what info the troubleshooters require. The forms address most pertinant information, and streamlines the diagnosis process. Most of the time it's a common problem that's easily diagnosed. Sometimes not.
    Were you to properly fill-out the form, prehaps we would have a broader sense of the conditions leading up to all this, and maybe there is something that will catch the experienced eye of someone with a firm understanding of growing cannabis. Or not.

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    I'm as calm as they come, what would suggest that I wasn't? anyhoo isn't the form you speak of the one I used in post #1? what did I leave out? Anyway no harm no foul, like I said just spreadin the word. If I had come across this post while I was searching for the issue, I would have felt much better. so hopefully it will help someone else some day.

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    I could've sworn that all this "mysterious" whitening was just known as albinoism (As I said in my last post)... I don't think its some groundbreaking discovery or anything. I've seen it happen to a few leaves on one of my friend's plants.

    Anyway, the correct troubleshooting form is filled out, just in an unusual way. Instead of simply filling in the answers, you erased the questions and answered them that way. Little harder to follow, but it will work.

    That being said, Rusty - perhaps you need to look a little harder for the forms? I filled one out in great detail for my Canoeing/Clawed leaves thread and you asked me a few questions that the form had already answered... I know you don't have all day to keep referencing things, but its a little frustrating to have to keep answering and re-answering questions. Even more frustrating though, is getting no help whatsoever. I'm always grateful for any responses, so in that regard, thank you.

    Everyone screws up once in a while. Just my $0.02
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    Quote Originally Posted by metalarclemon View Post
    Also I don't "dick" with people for no reason and those photos are untouched.
    Quote Originally Posted by metalarclemon View Post
    I'm as calm as they come, what would suggest that I wasn't?
    Perhaps it was your rather defensive denial to an obviously far-fetched possibility. But these days...a possibility indeed. Whatever...no harm no foul.

    Faddenator: The condition isn't mysterious. But the cause and effect are. If it is albinoism, (versus a chemical/enviornmental cause) then it's genetic. There...happy? I'm just looking for the reason, cause and/or purpose behind the 'random discoloration'. True albinoism has no color on entire plant or animal, does it? Any clues how a true albino plant would photosynthesize? (Hint: it cant) Why would you encourage a plant to expend all it's energy to produce unusable appendages?

    Years ago there was an Alaskan strain (I think it was an autoflower, but not completely sure) that showed early varriegation, but I'm pretty sure it grew out of the annomaly with time and maturity, and from the pix I saw...was more of a yellow than a white.

    Sorry if looking past the 'albinoism' theory seemed to yank your chain, but if he did get the seeds from a reputible breeder, and there was none of DJ Shorts varriegated strains listed as part of the strain heritage, then something or someone may be contaminating our seed stock, and I'm curious if this is the case. A white leaf can not photosynthesize. If this is a trait that is being encouraged by backyard breeders thinking it "looks cool" I would certainly think hard about preserving my strains, and keeping them from mingling with these "new-Improved" strains. With no industry controlls or regulation, this sort of thing will likely continue...but to what end?

    Also, why hasn't there been documented cases of this for the past 50 years if this is normal and nothing to be concerned with? I've been growing cannabis for many years (easily decades) without seeing this in my garden, nor seeing it in anybody elses' garden for that matter. Until a certain breeders' verriegated strains came along, that is. Perhaps he stumbled upon this genetic defect, perhaps he caused it. I'm just a little curious which it is, and how and why. Might even be a simple answer of no concern.

    I do what I can do to accomodate all with plant problems or questions. If my requests sound redundant, then either I skipped what was written, or am looking for more information. And no, I will not spend an extra 20 minutes muddling through a post looking for the hidden details. That's why there's a form. I care enough to help, but am only a human. A human with other responsibilites that far outweigh this forum. Perhaps were I paid a CanCom salary...

    I asked a few questions for my information base. I figured I could kill time till someone smarter than I responded to shed a more technical light on the issue. We all know that just didn't happen.

    But if the way I troubleshoot bothers you, please feel free wait till someone else lends a hand. I'm not the only one in here capable of answers.
    Last edited by Rusty Trichome; Feb-15-2010 at 13:38.

  22. #22
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    Rusty - I wasn't trying to offend you, though clearly that seems to have happened. I'm sorry.

    In terms of cannabis, I honestly thought that albinoism (A term which I learned on these forums) was a simple genetic defect that caused white streaks on leaves. I'm fully aware that 'true' albinos lack all pigment whatsoever, but 'albinoism' does not necessarily affect an entire organism.

    You may troubleshoot however you see fit. Since I've joined this site, you've stuck out to me as the most knowledgeable, learned member. That being said, If you decide to never answer another question of mine again, I might as well sign up for another forum. Not because no one else gives good advice, but because I'd much prefer being a member somewhere where I'm not targeted for making a simple observation. I sincerely hope this is not the case though - I like it here.

    Can we just forget I said anything?
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    Sorry Fad, I just get real tired of individuals getting on my case about not the advise I give, but the way I give it. I really don't give much of a crap any more, as I get enough satisfaction from the thank-you's, and the fuck-you's are usually personality driven. I offer advice because my wife and I would have been screwed were it not for a couple of breeders I learned from, quite a few years ago. So I'm payin' it forward till the game no longer holds my interest.

    When doing the quote thing, it's easier for me if I've got a few questions to answer, to use that system. Especially if responding to more than one member in the same post. Otherwise I get lost half way through the response. It isn't usually a spotlight, but more a reminder of the question/statement so there's no confusion. (granted, sometimes it is a spotlight though)

    Am I targeting you? No more than I target any other member. People come and go often in here, but all I usually see are questions or criticism, not the usernames and personalities. And of course...some days my fuse is shorter than on other's.

    Anyway, metalarclemon: good luck and sorry for the quazi-hijacking.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Trichome View Post
    Am I targeting you? No more than I target any other member. People come and go often in here, but all I usually see are questions or criticism, not the usernames and personalities. And of course...some days my fuse is shorter than on other's.
    :
    It sounded like you were going to ignore my questions from now on... I'm glad I was wrong.
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    Thanks for the help, every tidbit counts!

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