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Cow Manure

Discussion in 'Outdoor Growing' started by Trewalker, Sep 5, 2010.

  1. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    Howdy Folks !
    I found his forum a couple weeks ago and have been browsing as I have time (Great Forum!) I see that allot of you folks put allot of effort into your grows, but I see little mentioned abot cow manure, what gives? I have not grown in about 20 years but have started my holes already for next spring, with plans for a major effort. Back in the day I used cow manure and had no problems growing plants 10 to 15 foot tall, I am putting this in my holes now with 50 50 dirt/manure for the coming year, why is so little mentioned on this forum about manure ?

    Also, I'm on the east coast (US) and we have serious chopper issues about the second week of June for about a week, anyone out this way planted under the canopy of the forest (not full sun) and had any luck ? I really don't want karosene sparyed on mine and carried to the landfill :D
    C Yall Later :smokin:
     
  2. middieman440

    middieman440 Registered+

    theres absolutely nothing wrong with manure just dont use chicken poop it is bad for the plants,if you have rabiit poop that is the best stuff..but there is nothing wrong cow poo use it and enjoy,just dont use it as your only fertalizer since towards the end your going to need a bloom fertalizer......but ive grown with just cow/horse manure for the whole grow with wonderful results.nothings change since the old days.!

    some people here dont use it because they think spending money on fertalizer is better than the old fashion way.and they also think it can hurt the plants but it doesnt so use it...

    now for growing in a forest under tress not so good as you need as much direct sunlight as possible im from the east coast "ct" and grew with no problems just hide them well,clip the tops so they dont have the xmas tree look,pull them down as they are vegging the makes for a bigger yeild....theres ways around everything....but if you know what camoflauge is then you will be good
     
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  3. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    Yes I have read about pulling them down, but I don't understand exactly what you mean, are you pulling the top of the plant toward the ground ?

    Also I live in the same type of terrain as you middleman, I'm in VA which is allot like CT. Thanks for your imput

    PS: chicken poo works great in moderataion, most will use too much and burn the plants . a table spoon AWAY from the roots, works good, moderation is the key with chicken poo, as it is rich in nitrogen

     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2010
  4. middieman440

    middieman440 Registered+

    pulling them down,,,as they are vegging during the grow pull the top of the plant downwards till you feel pressure"like its going snap" then stop,the following week do the same,they key is to keep the plant from growing vertical and to allow the branches to grow upwards / < im using that as the stalk eventually it will lay flat and the branches will grow into main colas wich gives you more yeild,then you can also pull the branches and allow more growth...

    its hard to explain but easilly done,do it when they get about 3 foot tall and the stalk is still soft i use twine tieing it loosley to the middle of the stalk and pull downwards,after a week the upper portion obove the twine can be pulled downwards again,eventually you will end up with a plant that looks like a sideways L with a bunch of branches growing....
     
  5. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    I shall try that trick, thanks for the tip
     
  6. middieman440

    middieman440 Registered+

    no,problem
     
  7. airdawg13

    airdawg13 Registered+

    I have heard that when using manures there is a chance that you can burn your plants. Also only use fertilizers that are 100% organic. Chemical fertilizers can burn your plants and organic tends to taste better.

    My soil mix is....
    3 yards 80% Compost/20% Worm Casting. I mixed it with the native soil.
    10 bags of Perlite for drainage
    5 bags of Fox Farm Happy Frog organic soil mix
    10 bags of bone meal. For an organic phosphorus
    10 bags of blood meal. For an organic nitrogen nutrient
    3 bags of bat guano

    I fed my plants every other watering...
    Vegetative growth: Fox Farm Grow Big liquid plant food.
    Early flower growth: Fox Farm Tiger Bloom liquid plant food.
    Late flower growth: Fox Farm Big Bloom and Tiger Bloom.

    Also I would make teas with molasses and other organic nutrients when my plants started to flower.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2010
  8. Rusty Trichome

    Rusty Trichome Registered+

    Would love to see your proof of this statement, as I fell it's in error.

    A chemical compound is a chemical compound regardless of where it came from. There's no such distinction between organic chemical and plain old chemical, except in the marketing departments.

    Yes, you can burn the plants with organics. Try putting your ladies in straight manure, and see how long it takes to kill your plants.

    And no, the end result of using organics does not taste any better than a 'chemical' nutrient grow. You still want to regulate with proper nutrients, a proper pre-harvest flush and a proper cure, regardless.

    I'm guessing I'd use manure were I growing under a 100,000w sun all summer with unlimited rootspace and no height restrictions. But I would definately use it sparingly, as organics break-down slowly, and I wouldn't want too much residual nitrogen around when the plant is trying to flower.

    What kind of native soil? (sandy, heavy clay, forest compost, 'dirt'?) It makes a difference when recommending someone else follow your 'recipe'.

    Might want to read-up on teas. Especially homemade brews. (e-coli and salmonella come to mind)
    Compost Tea Myths

    Either you did, or you would...which is it? :wtf:

    I can appreciate the effort you've made to help a fellow member, and I'm not trying to pick on you...but you should get your facts straight before posting.
     
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  9. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    Overall I agree with Rusty, What I have done this year, and also many years ago, is make my holes the year before the plant and mix cow manure/and what ever soil happens to be in the chosen spot and I add a generous dose of lime, next spring there will be no burning, and the plant (in the past, and hopefully next year) will grow like a scared rabbit, and I won't have to do much but water if it gets dry for an extended period of time, and attempt to keep the deer away, of course I determine my spots starting out with defensive spots to be hidden from rogues, and the yearly chopper stampede
     
  10. airdawg13

    airdawg13 Registered+

    Please don't hate. This is my first year growing, and I am still learning as I go. The native soil here is a little bit on the acidic side and has lots of clay.

    Just saying that I would be very careful if your using chemical fertilizers and/or manures as your main source of nutrients. I am going off what I have read in books and what other growers have told me. Using chemical fertilizers and/or manures creates a greater chance of burning your plants. I didn't say not to use them, just saying there is less room for error. I have seen what happens when you use too much of a chemical fertilizer or too much of a manure. One of my friends lost half his garden from making too strong of a mix.

    With organic fertilizers (excluding manures) it is impossible to burn your plants. For example you cant use too much bone meal in your mix, whereas you can use too much cow manure. Organic ferts are broken down in the soil when the plant needs those nutrients. When using chemical fertilizers the plant is forced to use those nutrients immediately. Organic fertilizers are slower to release the nutrients and chemical fertilizers are released instantly. And Yes, I have heard hundreds of people say that bud taste better when grown 100% organic. Even with a good flush and cure. IMO compost>manure and organic>chemical. We can debate this all day, those are just my 2 cents.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2010
  11. airdawg13

    airdawg13 Registered+

    Organic vs Chemical

    Cannabis is a organic natural medicine. Why ruin it a whole bunch of man made chemicals?

    Organic fertilizers help to build micro-organisms in your soil. Soil mixes with lots of organic matter also holds in moisture and nutrients better. Organic fertilizers are made from plants, animals or rock powders. These nutrients are slowly broken down by the micro-organisms living in the soil. Your bud will taste better if grown 100% organic. Also if you want a quicker way to feed your plants organically, pick up fox farm organic liquids and foliar feed your plants!

    Chemical Fertilizers release nutrients fast which promotes faster growth. In my opinion, chemical fertilizers are released too fast and can burn your plants. Also because your top growth is too fast, the root system tends to fall behind. This creates an overall weaker plant. When using chemical fertilizers the soil tends to become lifeless. The high concentrations of mineral salts destroys the micro-organisms living in the soil.

    I can see chemical fertilizers being better for indoor use, but when growing outdoors 100% organic is the way to grow!
     
  12. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    You have read some books, and a great deal of marketing hype......... Not hating dude, thats just the way I see it. as far as your acidic soil, use lime
     
  13. airdawg13

    airdawg13 Registered+

    Jorge Cervantes, Jorge Cervantes. I grow for quality not quantity. It doesn't make since to grow medical marijuana without growing it organically. If your bud is full of chemicals it is probably bad for your health.
     

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    Last edited: Sep 10, 2010
  14. Trewalker

    Trewalker Registered

    O' Yea Lime is a natural "rock"..... that has been crushed, so fear not of lime, its your friend :)

     
  15. huckstah

    huckstah Registered

    Let's get back to the subject here, which is about the issue of using cow manure for cannabis. The answer is YES. I personally use cow manure with EVERYTHING I grow, including cannabis. The mix is your preference, as some farmers prefer 1 part manure to 4 parts soil (1/4), or 1 part manure to 3 parts soil. I personally go with a 1-to-4 ratio because the native soil I have is already very rich, and when it comes to more "valuable" crops it is better to be safer than sorry. I have successfully used this recipe for several years consecutive with no negative results whatsoever. A popular recipe among veteran homegrown growers in the south is to use cow manure during vegetative state of cannabis, tomatoes, corn, etc, because it is very rich in Nitrogen and decomposes into extremely rich soil for future plantings! Cow manure is a win/win situation, and a great fertilizer thats even safe for beginner gardeners as there is minimal little risk of burning compared to much stronger and more dangerous fertilizers. Another great feature of cow manure is that it decomposes rather quickly throughout the long outdoor veg season, so you won't taste all those nasty nitrogens when it comes time to flowering. Other fertizlizers don't decompose as naturally, or quickly, meaning you will have to waste more time and energy flushing your plants of all those nasty chemicals. During the flowering stage, you can add potash and phosphate, but personally I've never needed to do this when it comes to cannabis. As long as your soil is quality, and you didn't go overboard on the compost/manure ratio, all you need to do is learn your watering schedule and your sativa's will be more than happy. I start early in the season (April), and my sativas average 12-15 feet in height and yield several pounds, using ONLY cow manure and native soil. I will start a journal this year of a crop I will grow strictly from mexican-brick bag seed, and show that anyone can grow quality buds and huge yield using a minimum of chemicals and tools.
     
  16. huckstah

    huckstah Registered

    Lime is a great natural fertilizer that farmers have been using for centuries to balance the PH of soil, so yes, indeed, lime is definitely a long-time friend of man and will continue to be for many centuries to come. I am extremely lucky that the soil in our area has lime already it, and I wouldn't trade my dirt for any of the stuff people buy at the gardening center.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2013
  17. huckstah

    huckstah Registered

    When it comes to using cow manure, this is what I do to prepare my mix, and I suggest you do the the same thing:

    1) Lay out a large tarp, plastic sheeting, or my personal favorite: tin roofing sheets.

    2) Collect your dirt. I use native soil, but I live in a rich region. Depending where you live, you may want to buy soil from your local hardware/gardening center.

    3) Put your dirt on top of the tarp or plastic sheeting, and SPREAD IT OUT EVENLY. Don't just put into a large pile, or it defeats the entire process of what we are doing.

    4) Collect your manure. Make SURE this manure is atleast 3 months or older. You'll be able to tell this by prying it open with a stick and making sure it is completely LIGHT BROWN throughout every layer, including the top and the bottom. It should essentially look like an extremely compressed clump of dead brown grass, which is exactly what it is. If it is dark brown throughout any layer, don't use it, as the manure is still "burning" and considered too hot to use for young plants.

    5) Collect your manure and CRUSH it up thoroughly. I personally put the manure into a 5 gallon bucket, and use a small hand-shovel or spade to break it up until each clump is less than 1/4 inch in size. It's important to have this broken up as much as possible so that you get an even distribution in your mix.

    6) Take your crushed up manure and pour it on top of your soil, remembering to maintain a 1/4 ratio. Make sure the manure and soil is tossed and mixed as much as possible. I use a ho and a square-head shovel for this, turning the entire pile over 10+ times on all sides.

    7) This is the easiest, but most important step: LET IT COOK. Given you have a few decent days a week of sunlight, this mix will "cook" and decompose under the sun. Allow this pile too cook for atleast 3 months, remembering to turn this pile over ONCE A WEEK to ensure that all of the layers of dirt and manure cook evenly.

    You should start your entire process 3+ months before planting. Really, 3-6 months is ideal, and some people will even go to the extent of cooking ot for over a year. Although ideal, that's a bit excessive and not really necessary unless the manure is dark/fresh. I honestly forget some years and make my mix about 6-8 weeks before planting, and I can tell you that I have never had a problem with that. But then again, I look for very old piles of manure, and keep my ratio down more than others. Hoipe this helps anyone and I encourage all growers give it a try.

    That's it. It's a great and simple mix for beginners, and veteran growers of 60+ years experience still use it to this day on everything that grows under the sun, especially including marijuana! Try it this year and you might just find out you've been wasting far too much money on chemicals and store-purchased fertilizers.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2013
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  18. Shovelhandle

    Shovelhandle Registered+

    composted manure only, this goes for any manures, especially chicken. If it hasn't been actively composted and just was sitting in a pile I'd say a year old. My neighbors have horse stables and brought manure for my veg garden and I'd leave it until the following spring. Now I have my own composter so I don't get the manure delivered any more.
    25% compost is a good amount, no more than that. The best thing you can do, in my opinion is to till the soil deep and wide.

    Good info from good people HERE
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2013
  19. vaper

    vaper Registered

    I would avoid using bone meal and blood meal outside

    Every time I've used blood and bone meal outside, I have animals digging up my freshly planted seedlings.

     
  20. built2spill

    built2spill Registered+

    Feed the soil not the plant.

    You have most of what you need already in your house or compost pile.

    As for the Chicken Hawks (fly overs happen for me usually first week or so of Aug). The best way to avoid them for me has been to spread the plants out. I like about a 10 yrd. space between any plants. Avoid leaving trails by taking different routes and taking the biggest steps you can take. If you notice a trail developing give the weeds in the trail some nutes and the trail will be gone in a few days. The plots need to have sun the more the better.

    I plant about 50 clones in the spring. Watering can be an extensive ordeal but when it's harvest time I can't wait to do it all over again!
     

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